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Trusted Contributor
trodas
Posts: 93
Registered: 04-07-2005
0

X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

In spring 2006 I finally get my hands on X-Fi Fatal1ty card. The reason for upgrade from my Audigy2zs was mostly the pause bug, BF2 support (I started play BF2 a lot) and the X-ram thing, that provide 64MB soundbuffer that should dramaticaly reduce PCI load - hence give me some speed-up :smileyhappy: Or so I thought. The first nasty surprise when I actually get the card in my hand was this:

Not only the unnecessary long legs, but mainly the capacitors type - Jamicons. Jamicon cap's are bad, they are known to fail - eg. over time lost most of their specs.
At first, everything work great, except some weird noises when BF2 is loading sounds. (maybe the card did not like OGM playback when there is going writing samples to the X-ram? Or my A9R480 Sapphire Grouper mobo is up to blame?) However after like 2 months are the pause bug back.

When I say pause bug, I mean this. Using any player, play a AC3 5.1 movie while using 5.1 speakers on analog connection. Decoding filter has to be AC3 filter and it has to use 24bit output to generate enough data to trigger the failure. Now randomly pause and unpause the playback. Sooner ot later the channels start play from wrong speakers and/or there is terrible noise from all speakers comming after the unpause. This is a pause bug. I had it on Audigy (1), Audigy2zs and after two months on X-Fi as well.

It was obvious that the X-Fi is need to be recapped and the Jamicons changed to good, preferably audio caps - but NOT for all positions. The catch is, that Creative did use one capacitor type for all positions - eg. for the voltage filtering as well, as for the audio output. That is nonsense at best. Audio and computers capacitors don't mix!
So, they simply put Jamicons everywhere. Not something that I would expect from 260$ pricetag (spring 2006, mind you) product :smileymad:


Now why I started this thread.

Well, to begin with, some weeks ago (to 14. 8. 2006) I started to play Mafia - a original Czech game of the 1930 NewYork organized crime. You simply work your way up in the organization at prohibition times, drive old cars, steal, murder and finally seek salvation from the hands of cops... During play it sometimes in these briefing talking scenes is seems to starting to lost some samples. I thought that the Czech programmers engine simply could have some quirks with 64MB of sample buffer on X-Fi Fatal1ty. After all, as the game release there was not such a thing as X-Fi, right? However the more I play and the closer to the end I was, the more often it happening. And it kinda suxx to go on mission and not know the briefing, right? However as I finished the game, the problems are gone, so...

So then I started play Prey :smileyhappy: And when shortly in game in one spot appears more sounds at once (your girl scream, mechanic move, buttons, alien...), the whole computer freeze. I remember the Jamicons and quickly pull the X-Fi out and replaced the big Jamicon (originaly a 220uF 16V) with Panny FM 470uF 16V as well, as two 100uF Jamicons with 120uF Panny FM ones.


The results.

I finished whole Prey in few days of hard gaming w/o crash or any problem. I went back to Mafia and - whoa, samples aren't lost anymore again. My apology, Czech programmers. I did not trusted in yours skils... :smileysurprised: In adition, the pause bug is - GONE! :smileyvery-happy:


Later.

So I added the frontpannel later (moth or so), but in like a week, problems and pausebug are there again. Frontpannel is full of Jamicons too, and it obviously accelerated the dying of Jamicons on card or so. I pulled it out, yet the pause bug is still there. No crashing, luckily.


I would like to hear from X-Fi and perhaps also Audigy2(zs) users about their experience and possibly about their sound bugs. There is so many people that claim to have similar issues as me, so... I wonder in how many cases this could be avoided just by using good caps and not Jamicon crap...

 

To completely recap X-Fi you need:

x-Fi Fata1ity
-------------
1x 220uF 16V - P12376-ND (I recommend there 1000uF Samxon GC 6.3V)
2x 100uF 16V - P12922-ND
3x 47uF 16V - P11196-ND
28x 22uF 16V - P11213-ND
10x 10uF 16V - P11212-ND
7x 4.7uF 50V - P10315-ND


Audigy 2zs
----------
3x 100uF 16V d6.3 (Jamicon) - P12922-ND
5x 47uf 16V d5 (Teapo) - P11196-ND
35x 22uF 16V d4 (Jamicon) - P11213-ND
5x 10uF 16V d4 (Jamicon) - P11212-ND
11x 4.7uF 50V d4 (Jamicon) - P10315-ND
3x 1uF 50V d4 (Wincap) - P10312-ND

(digi-key.com product numbers used)

"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong." - Voltaire
...just keep folding, just keep folding...   :smileyhappy:   my config
Trusted Contributor
chrischin
Posts: 98
Registered: 02-05-2006
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

Hello trodas, I'm not technical, Jamicon are the capasitors used on the X-Fi card? You mean these are cheap capasitors that are used on the X-Fi cards that cost us US$300? and the reason for all the cracking and poping sounds?
 
Thanks.
Trusted Contributor
trodas
Posts: 93
Registered: 04-07-2005
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

Yes, exactly that. Jamicon are crap capacitors and using them on such pricey cards are unforgivable. It give one all sorts of problems, from not detecting to problems running to the pause bug, noise and stuff...

Proper audio capacitors are Elna RFS Silmic, Cerafine or Nichicon KZ if not (for the price!) Black Gate N ones.

NEVER Jamicons.

And especialy never use Jamicons where hi-grade voltage cap has to be used - eg. in the voltage filtering for the main chip. 220uF Jamicon is laughable there. Check what I did with 470uF Panasonic FM in his position! Instant fix of all troubles! (but if you use the frontpannel, then you have to recap it also completely...)
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong." - Voltaire
...just keep folding, just keep folding...   :smileyhappy:   my config
Trusted Contributor
chrischin
Posts: 98
Registered: 02-05-2006
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

trodas, am I correct that you suggest the following capacitors to be changed?

x-Fi
-------------
1x 220uF 16V - P12376-ND (I recommend there 1000uF Samxon GC 6.3V)
2x 100uF 16V - P12922-ND
3x 47uF 16V - P11196-ND
28x 22uF 16V - P11213-ND
10x 10uF 16V - P11212-ND
7x 4.7uF 50V - P10315-ND

And you've resolder yours and now it is working?

 

 

Trusted Contributor
trodas
Posts: 93
Registered: 04-07-2005
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

Yes, you are correct. I did not like erratic problems coming from bad caps. As for my problems, as I write, the worsest ones get fixed by just exchanging there caps. Good deal, eh?
And no, I did not yet exchange the rest, as Hi-Fi fanatics told me, that I better use quality Audio capacitors to dramaticaly improve the X-Fi sound. So, they got me hooked for at least Elna caps :smileyhappy:
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong." - Voltaire
...just keep folding, just keep folding...   :smileyhappy:   my config
Contributor
cyclone3d
Posts: 26
Registered: 11-10-2005
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

By the way, CL people, this soluton actually makes very logical sense.
 
#1. problems are being seen on many different types of systems
 
#2. Not everybody has these problems
 
#3. This person actually did some toubleshooting/re-working of the card and has gotten it fixed....
 
This somehow reminds me of the capacitor fiasco with ABIT and just about every other motherboard manufacturer of a few years ago.
 
It also reminds me of the DELL GX/SX 260-280 fiasco of last year (we are still replacing those boards that have blown caps).
 
I am going to bookmark this thread... let's see if anything comes of it.
Contributor
Shotty
Posts: 34
Registered: 01-16-2007
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

[ Edited ]
thats a guy that should be working for creative
 
i was thinking though, after watching these forums past couple days,i realized that creative techs prolly dont come in here and respond much because it would be like walking up to an angry mob carrying torches and pitchforks lol
 
 

Message Edited by Shotty on 01-17-200709:28 PM

Trusted Contributor
damulta
Posts: 178
Registered: 06-11-2006
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

X-Fi recall
Trusted Contributor
chrischin
Posts: 98
Registered: 02-05-2006
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

X-Fi recall? damulta, I hope so too!
Trusted Contributor
damulta
Posts: 178
Registered: 06-11-2006
0

Re: X-Fi sound bugs? I think I have a solution.

I think they should if this is the problem witht the cards. 240 usd for my Xf-I fatal1ty and it has problems.....They should let me send it in to be FIXED!